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Major Hurricane Milton | Peak 180mph 897 mb | Advisories Discontinued


StretchCT

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3 minutes ago, Undertakerson2.0 said:

I mentioned yesterday that the steering winds indicated the stronger the storm - the more south the track. 

 

Steering winds and shear are 2 different things. Wondering out loud that if it more south , will it miss some of the shear ???

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Just now, RTC3-LAST CHANCE said:

Steering winds and shear are 2 different things. Wondering out loud that if it more south , will it miss some of the shear ???

I'm saying that SHR won't matter with it being so powerful (SHR did not stop Helene, that one shrugged the SHR off as if it was mere nuisance)  - it has more than ample divergence going for it (SHR is actually enhancing that) and to think - it's not even to the 30c part of the basin yet.

This might not weaken except for ERC

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Just now, Undertakerson2.0 said:

I'm saying that SHR won't matter with it being so powerful (SHR did not stop Helene, that one shrugged the SHR off as if it was mere nuisance)  - it has more than ample divergence going for it (SHR is actually enhancing that) and to think - it's not even to the 30c part of the basin yet.

This might not weaken except for ERC

image.thumb.png.9c9f42c203c8b956fe53a1ff4f918b0e.png

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18z intensity models. Some messed up ones in there.  12 GFS has arrival hrs 63-66. 12z euro hr 66.  HFWRF hr 72 HAFS A hr 66.  

So lets go with 66 hrs until landfall from 12z, so its 60 hrs until landfall for 18z.  The gray line is hr 60. Official is right on cat 4 line.  

There's quite a few under that. I'm hoping the faster and larger they become, the faster they fall apart.  We might set a record for intensification but maybe we also set one for weakening prior to landfall. 

image.png.9ba82fc8849e70a9341cad9ea6e874ae.png

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5pm discussion highlights:  Last data was 911 mb and satellite showed continued intensification hence the increase to 180 and 905mb. Moving east now at 9kts.  Low shear and warm water continue through the night but radar showing signs of ERC. This could be the most destructive storm on record for western central Florida. 

Spoiler
Hurricane Milton Discussion Number  11
NWS National Hurricane Center Miami FL       AL142024
400 PM CDT Mon Oct 07 2024

Satellite images indicate that Milton is quite a powerful hurricane.
The small eye has become even more distinct than earlier today, and
radar data from Sabancuy show a small, closed eye with a very 
strong eyewall presentation.  On the last fix before the plane
departed a few hours ago, the Air Force Hurricane Hunter crew
reported that the pressure had fallen to 911 mb, which is 77 mb
lower than yesterday at the same time, with other data to support
150 kt.  Since the satellite imagery continues to show
intensification, the initial wind speed is set to 155 kt, and a pair
of Hurricane Hunters should be in the area this evening for more 
information.

The hurricane is moving eastward at about 9 kt.  Milton should move 
close to the northern portion of Yucatan Peninsula tonight and early 
Tuesday ahead of a mid-level trough dropping into the northwestern 
Gulf of Mexico.  This feature should then cause Milton to move 
east-northeastward to northeastward at a faster forward speed 
later on Tuesday and Wednesday.  Little change was made to the 
previous forecast, with the latest model guidance very close to the 
previous forecast cycle, and this forecast remains close to a 
consensus of the latest GFS, ECMWF and regional hurricane models. 
Note that this track is closer to the model fields rather than the 
model trackers which appear to be too far south.

Milton could strengthen even more tonight with light shear and 
very warm waters providing a conducive environment.  However, radar 
data indicate that Milton could be at the beginning of an eyewall 
replacement cycle, with some signs of a moat and a partial outer 
eyewall.  The evolution will likely cause the system to gradually 
weaken on Tuesday but grow larger.  On Wednesday, Milton is expected 
to encounter a less favorable environment with strong shear and dry 
air entrainment, with further weakening forecast.  Regardless, the 
system is expected to be a large and powerful hurricane at landfall 
in Florida, with life-threatening hazards at the coastline and well 
inland.  Residents in Florida should closely follow the orders from 
their local emergency management officials, as Milton has the 
potential to be one of the most destructive hurricanes on record 
for west-central Florida.


Key Messages:

1. Damaging hurricane-force winds and a life-threatening storm surge 
with destructive waves are expected across portions of the northern 
coast of the Yucatan Peninsula through tonight.   

2. Milton is expected to grow in size and remain an extremely 
dangerous hurricane when it approaches the west coast of Florida on 
Wednesday. A large area of destructive storm surge will occur along 
parts of the west coast of Florida on Wednesday.  This is an 
extremely life-threatening situation and residents in those areas 
should follow advice given by local officials and evacuate 
immediately if told to do so.

3. Potentially devastating hurricane-force winds are expected along 
portions of the west coast of Florida where a Hurricane Warning is 
in effect.  Milton is forecast to remain a hurricane as it crosses 
the Florida Peninsula and life-threatening hurricane-force winds, 
especially in gusts, are expected to spread inland across a portion 
of the entire Florida Peninsula.  Preparations to protect life and 
property in the warning areas should be complete by Tuesday night 
since tropical storm conditions are expected to begin within this 
area early Wednesday. 

4. Areas of heavy rainfall will impact portions of Florida today 
well ahead of Milton, with heavy rainfall more directly related to 
the system expected later on Tuesday through Wednesday night. This 
rainfall will bring the risk of considerable flash, urban, and areal 
flooding, along with the potential for moderate to major river 
flooding.

FORECAST POSITIONS AND MAX WINDS

INIT  07/2100Z 21.8N  90.8W  155 KT 180 MPH
 12H  08/0600Z 21.9N  89.4W  160 KT 185 MPH
 24H  08/1800Z 22.7N  87.4W  150 KT 175 MPH
 36H  09/0600Z 24.2N  85.6W  140 KT 160 MPH
 48H  09/1800Z 26.1N  84.0W  125 KT 145 MPH
 60H  10/0600Z 27.9N  82.6W  110 KT 125 MPH...INLAND
 72H  10/1800Z 29.2N  79.5W   75 KT  85 MPH...OVER WATER
 96H  11/1800Z 30.5N  71.0W   55 KT  65 MPH...POST-TROP/EXTRATROP
120H  12/1800Z 31.0N  65.0W   40 KT  45 MPH...POST-TROP/EXTRATROP

Current radar (this is why I'm not an expert)

image.png.8f79cb76cb88f0a8840b41bde3e19a37.png

INIT  07/2100Z 21.8N  90.8W  155 KT 180 MPH
 12H  08/0600Z 21.9N  89.4W  160 KT 185 MPH
 24H  08/1800Z 22.7N  87.4W  150 KT 175 MPH
 36H  09/0600Z 24.2N  85.6W  140 KT 160 MPH
 48H  09/1800Z 26.1N  84.0W  125 KT 145 MPH
 60H  10/0600Z 27.9N  82.6W  110 KT 125 MPH...INLAND
 72H  10/1800Z 29.2N  79.5W   75 KT  85 MPH...OVER WATER
 96H  11/1800Z 30.5N  71.0W   55 KT  65 MPH...POST-TROP/EXTRATROP
120H  12/1800Z 31.0N  65.0W   40 KT  45 MPH...POST-TROP/EXTRATROP
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4 minutes ago, StretchCT said:

18z intensity models. Some messed up ones in there.  12 GFS has arrival hrs 63-66. 12z euro hr 66.  HFWRF hr 72 HAFS A hr 66.  

So lets go with 66 hrs until landfall from 12z, so its 60 hrs until landfall for 18z.  The gray line is hr 60. Official is right on cat 4 line.  

There's quite a few under that. I'm hoping the faster and larger they become, the faster they fall apart.  We might set a record for intensification but maybe we also set one for weakening prior to landfall. 

image.png.9ba82fc8849e70a9341cad9ea6e874ae.png

I can buy weakening for sure, but the extreme weakening to cat 1/2 just seems highly suspicious.  What is going to cause it to fall apart to that extent?  Yes, shear and dry air entrainment can do a number on systems sometimes, but it's unclear how much of a problem that will be.  Also, and this is crucial, we are not looking at a dramatic slowdown in forward speed as it approaches landfall. 

We often talk about storms running out of time to strengthen before landfall, but I think this is going to be a case of running out of time to weaken (to an extent).

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I firmly believe they need to revisit the Saffir-Simpson scale.  Is it possible that the Category of storm is loosely associated with the force of the wind?  Very loosely.  (If I were to re-categorize for the US hurricane scale, I would use the force of the wind as a baseline)

IMG_5149.thumb.jpeg.9e3187c1fddbc4d80196100a144bc19e.jpeg

Force (or pressure) is based on the square of wind speed.  
IMG_5152.thumb.jpeg.709668e1d3827994eb4101bfa45673df.jpeg

If a hurricane force wind begins at 74mph (category 1), then its force/pressure would be 14.01 lbs/sqft.

At category 2, 96 miles per hour, exerts 23.59 lbs/sqft.  That’s a 168% of the force of a 74mph Category 1, even though wind speed is just increased by 29%.  

In chart format:

Cat1=14.01 lbs/sqft. 
Cat2=23.59 lbs/sqft. = 1.68 x Cat1 force
Cat3=31.54lbs/sqft. = 2.21 x Cat1 force
Cat4=43.26 lbs/sqft. = 3.08 x Cat1 force
Cat5=63.10 lbs/sqft. = 4.50 x Cat 1 force

A hypothetical Cat 6 of 175mph, for example) would be approximately 5.5x Cat1 force.  
 

My proposed scale would be more closely associated with the square of the wind speed.  There would be no upper limit…

 

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Was too busy writing my Ted Talk about Saffir-Simpson, so it’s an hour old but…

 

BULLETIN
Hurricane Milton Advisory Number  11
NWS National Hurricane Center Miami FL       AL142024
400 PM CDT Mon Oct 07 2024

...HURRICANE AND STORM SURGE WARNINGS ISSUED FOR PORTIONS OF THE 
FLORIDA WEST COAST...
...MILTON POSES AN EXTREMELY SERIOUS THREAT TO FLORIDA AND 
RESIDENTS ARE URGED TO FOLLOW THE ORDERS OF LOCAL OFFICIALS...


SUMMARY OF 400 PM CDT...2100 UTC...INFORMATION
----------------------------------------------
LOCATION...21.8N 90.8W
ABOUT 80 MI...125 KM WNW OF PROGRESO MEXICO
ABOUT 675 MI...1085 KM SW OF TAMPA FLORIDA
MAXIMUM SUSTAINED WINDS...180 MPH...285 KM/H
PRESENT MOVEMENT...E OR 90 DEGREES AT 10 MPH...17 KM/H
MINIMUM CENTRAL PRESSURE...905 MB...26.73 INCHES

 

Edited by Burr
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