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Dec. 9-12, 2023 | Potential Winter Storm


snowlover2

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1 minute ago, Ohiobuckeye45 said:

this is where it starts to change

 

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That would would be awesome to see even a heavy quick burst at the end but I've seen this movie a lot of times. 

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2 minutes ago, BuckeyeGal said:

Perhaps our more knowledgeable folks could discuss what could possibly change with this setup! 😊

I'm not knowledgeable but I'm gonna go with moisture is gone before it gets cold for 1000 Alex. At least for my area.

Models have always loved to show this and I really don't think I've ever seen more than 5 minutes of flurries out of it. 

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12 minutes ago, Ohiobuckeye45 said:

hard for a positively tilted setup to produce snow in this setup, mega arctic front

 

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I'm thinking if the pieces of energy near James bay can get out in front a bit more and flatten that ridging near the St Lawrence, it could somewhat improve.  Still a few days. I know in my area, these ridges quite often are over modeled.

Definitely disappointing to see deep lows modeled 5+ days out, to see them wither into waves along a front.   We've seen that a few times later fall into early winter this year.

 The positive tilt could bring a little more cold down in front, then you'd need the Southern end to really dig, slow, and turn.

 It's another one of those complex trofs, multiple pieces of energy that need to be resolved. It'll undoubtedly change, just can't be sure what will change, and if it'll be beneficial.

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Excellent write-up from met Josh Ketchen:

Quote
Focus for the weekend storm is still not clear. What started out as a very warm storm on main global runs, despite a couple runs of snowier solutions, is struggling to figure out if the cold air wins out or warmer air holds its ground.
 
Now, I have briefly mentioned how the subtropical jet stream is raging from south of Hawaii, through Mexico, and into the Gulf or southeastern United States. This will support drainage of colder air and better cold storm potential as we progresses farther into Winter. This is causing issues with the approaching storm this weekend for the area.
 
The models are developing either a secondary low to form south of the region with a lot more energy then the northern low that occludes, or it is trying to refocus the main low farther south and east then what main runs have been suggesting the last few days. This is why I showed the Euro AI graphcast model that has had the low east for the overwhelming majority of runs. It is in its infant stages for being tested on its performance, but it has done quite well. Let's face it, most of the global models have done poorly late Summer into Autumn.
 
Being 3.5 to 4 days out is still a modest amount of time for things to change, which we know they will, plus, better sampling of this storm will start as we head into Thursday and Friday. This is why waiting until Friday to get into specifics is needed.
 
The main key, even the robustly warm GFS has developed a new secondary low on the 12Z run this late morning, which falls more in line with what the European and Canadian has been doing the last couple of main runs. So patience is needed to figure out key pieces of this storm.
So, I stress again, do not worry about cold air placement and timing, those will come into much better agreement Thursday into Friday. Focus on the considerable shift eastward with the low track, either A) a secondary low as the first low occludes or B) the main surface low shifting considerably farther south and east.

 

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5 hours ago, Grace said:

Does this qualify as an east trend? 🤣

 

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It’s only a 999 mile difference.. I think it would need to be 1000.1 miles to be an eastward trend. Duh. 😂 

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The Dec 12 0Z AI model runs are all similar, weak lows up the west edge of Apps (just west of the global's tracks.)  

Maybe some OH folks east of I-71 can see some "white rain" late Sunday and maybe a light covering overnight Sunday.

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Just doesn’t look like there’s enough cold air in place fast enough for this system. That can be a factor in a El Niño winter in December.

Oh well. I got a few inches of snow last night for the first snow of the season.

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